Re: The New Vanguard! Frostbite Issue #7 - Cold and Afraid!

Admin Fri Nov 16 2018, 09:40

OOC Ok, given the time we've played the game and how much we've covered vs how little the characters have improved, each player will get an extra 500HP to be spent purely on improving their character. I will try and make the process as easy as possible.

1) Each Attribute/power/skill has a FACTOR COST from 1 to 10. 1 is very easy and cheap to increase/improve, 10 is the most expensive. (Although 10 can be exceeded by adding perks/advantages!).

2) With that in mind I will list the factor cost in RED on your character sheet. From there look at the 'Increasing Attributes' chart:

ACTION Attributes are Dex, Int and Infl (Dexterity, Intelligence and influence). Other Attributes are Str, Will Aura (Strength, Will, Aura) which are your EFFECT attributes and Body, Mind, Spirit which are your RESISTANCE attributes.

Powers and Skills have their own factor costs. I will work though them and list the factor cost on the character sheet. This may take a while. With 500 points to spend, take a look at what you want to boost. For example Frostbite has Dex of 9 and wants 10. That costs 105 HP on the chart to improve Dex by 1 point.

Some powers and skills are LINKED (marked with a *) which means they were cheaper to buy in the first place but MUST be improved by the same amount as the link Attribute. For instance Frostbite has Dex 9 and Flight: 9* (linked) which means Flight must also be boosted to 10. However, because it is linked, it's cheaper than usual and to boost flight to 10 would cost only 15 HP.

To buy new powers or skills costs a lot. It costs 10x the Base Cost, then APs are bought. HOWEVER with 500HP (several years worth of HPs from play) it is still doable so if there is anything you fancy adding, I'll look at the costs.

The easiest way to do this is to look at your character sheets make a shortlist of things you want to increase (or buy new) or even get rid of certain limitations (Also expensive, but doable) and I will sort out the mechanics. It's not hard, but it is messy if you don't know the rules and don't have time to grind through the rulebook!

Your character sheets are Here

Steeple_jackuk Fri Nov 16 2018, 20:52

Right, will look at this tomorrow and hopefully have some ideas in order of priority to offer up.

Thanks, Paul

Sj

Steeple_jackuk Mon Nov 19 2018, 21:05

Lionheart:

Ok several things come to mind about Lionheart's character and since it easier to just ask, “Can I do this or some combination etc” I think I’ll offer up a shopping list of thoughts

1. Its bothered me a bit that though Lionheart is a one-man army, with Saladin inside a lot of his powers (like forcefield) offer protection on for him. Is there a way I can push this beyond myself, or make some sort of force field shield around those weaker than me?

2. Some of my skills and powers get used a lot, some go unused, but I’d love to change that for instance Detective, being a super cop of the future, must mean I get better at some things like that. I always liked the fact he is part Batman and big part Superman etc. Same goes for medicine, that has come in use more than once, be good to give that a boost. Makes a change making the heavy hitter being the field medic.

3. My problem beyond that is that Lionheart seems so powerful I am really not sure what else I can do that doesn’t put him so far and above the others that he kinds of overshadows them a bit. I love that he has the team, covered, and in this latest adventure depowered has proven to be deeply challenging, I’m looking forward to seeing him get his licks in again.

But beyond what I’ve offered what would you say Paul?

As for Frostbite, he has managed but compared to playing Lionheart, he is the much more fragile character…

1. On one level I’d like to see his Charisma and leadership skills increased. Military science is another area that the soldier just becomes more of that strategist.

2. Also I think I have got serious benefit from Frostbot, and perhaps anything we can do to up his abilities, might help – as I think he has proven to be a huge advantage I never imagined and in some ways I think I’ve already got upgrades for him that were never factored in and would like to be so now.

3. Flight, Strength, power blast, are the obvious offence powers Frostbite could do with upgrading. Perhaps with a better chance of hitting, or greater accuracy – I think of Hawkeyes, never missing type of thing. It doesn’t mean every shot does critical or huge damage but that he is just not one to miss etc.

4. Again besides that I kind of not sure where to go. Or indeed without trawling through the rules (if I can locate them) where and what the trajectory of powers along their current path takes us. But I am open to suggestions.

Ok, let’s see where we go with this…

Sj

Admin Tue Nov 20 2018, 07:07

OOC With regards Lionheart...

1. Adding a protective power to help others means Force Shield or Field. Field he has, but it's self only. You can try to buy off the limitations (very expensive) or simply buy a new version of the power.

Ok, we have Force Field. It will cost 300 points simply to buy 0 APs. Each AP then costs 60 per point until 8, then 90 from 9-15. So 5 APs would cost 600HP. Gulp. Works like the Invisible womans projected dome like bubble.

Force Shield makes a disc of energy which you can interpose between someone and an attack. It won't protect from all attacks 360 degrees around but if some behemoth or blaster tries to squish a team mate, it might just save you the hassle of finding a spatula to scrape them up afterwards. This costs 100HP to buy then 50HP per AP up to 8, 75HP per AP from 9 to 15.

So 300HP will buy you 4APs. 350HP 5APs, 400HP 6APs...

2. Boosting any of your skills means boosting the linked stats too. It will cost 285HP to boost Int to 10 which also includes boosting Detective, Medicine and Directional Hearing, which are linked.

3. Lionheart is several levels higher than the others so fits into the team as Superman/Thor to their Cap America/Vision level powers (though neither of those is a pushover). If you want to continue running two characters, we can stay with Lionheart and adventures appropriate to his power level (meaning he doesn't mix so much with the others) or you can cook up another character. No need to study the rules, just come up with an outline and I'll cost them up. LH would still be around, but more of a background/flavour type character.
No worries either way, but the next adventure I have planned (as a crossover for all of you) will push everyone (including Lionheart) to their limits. For instance (from Davids thread), a near comatose ADJUTANT (about the same power level as Lionheart) dropped from the sky and ...

Just then Adjutant coughed, spluttered, turned to his side and spewed gallons of black gunk out from his lungs! He seemed to be at it for a while and the pair of heroes wondered what on earth could do this to him, and how he could survive the experience!

"They're coming..." he spluttered, still spitting black gunk. "The Shadows... Darkening... they're coming!" he groaned through hoarse lungs, then he sagged, into deep unconsciousness!

To give you an idea of the size of the challenge headed your way. And a direction change for the game (which I will cook up and put to you both before pulling the trigger on).

I'll look at Frostbite a bit later on today...

Admin Tue Nov 20 2018, 16:35

OOC Strewth my eyes really are getting wonky these days. Typing without reading glasses probably accounts for all the typos I churn out. Well, that and not being able to spell

Glasses on. OK, let's see (see what I did there? No? Pffft... )

In the DC Heroes game when you LINK a power or skill to an attribute it makes it easier to buy BUT you have to raise all the attribute/power/skill levels whenever you improve the character and that makes things trickier. Another way of making things cheaper is to put limitations on stuff. Like Burnouts. Burnouts happen whenever a dice roll pops up of 2, 3 or 5 (depending on how severe the Burnout is) and as a result you lose the use of the power until an hour goes buy and you can recover it (Regeneration doesn't make it come back any sooner like it would your Body/Mind/Spirit stats that have taken a beating, and Frosty knows all about that...).

So, in terms of powers:

ice Control, ice production, sealed systems, dispersal, weather control, regeneration, icing are all LINKED
Of those Weather Control and ice control also have a catastrophic burnout (roll 5 or less to burn it out for an hour). They are cheap to increase.

Energy Blast and Adrenaline Surge have Burnouts making them cheap. It will cost 60HP for every point you want to increase Adrenaline surge by. This effectively boosts a whole load of your powers all at once, albeit you are boosting one power at a time, so strength, dispersal etc but not strength AND dispersal at the same time.

Energy Blast is incredibly cheap to boost. To boost from 14APs (current) to 15 costs only 15HP! After that every extra AP from 16-24 costs just 20HP.

Be careful though. If you boost Energy blast up so high it effectively makes Frostbite a heavy hitter in terms of who he can take on. Sure, he can pound anyone really hard (heck, he'd give Lionheart avery very good run for his money with 24 or more energy blast!) but that's purely offensive. Lionheart could one shot Frostbite if he got one good hit in. Lights out. Kaput.

That would be like, say, giving Robin a super powerful raygun and sending him out against Darkseid. Sure, Robin could potentially take Darkseid out, but if he doesn't...? Darkseid will DEFINITELY take Robin out.

So it's best to go for a balanced approach. Couple of APs on energy blast, maybe 1-2 on Adrenaline surge, 1-2 on Dex/Str/Body or defensive abilities...

As far as Frostbot goes, he's very nearly become his own independent self on a number of occasions. That's the risk you run of giving an AI a free rein. They get used to the freedom, then crave it. I think it's a very interesting facet of the character because there have been quite a few occasions where Frostbot has been tempted to go his own way when in a robot/cyborg body etc.

In terms of improvement, there's not much to do with Frostbot rather than make him (it) smarter or better able to control machines.

Skills are good (now that I've changed their use dramatically with the house ruling) because they give you extra dice to roll when they apply to actions, saving you Hero Points. in a way they are overpowered and too cheap now, but because their focus is so narrow - for instance to use vehicles you actually need a vehicle, weaponry you need a weapon and so on - it kind of reins it in. I think David M thought about getting rid of Weaponry (Melee weapons) as he didn't think he used it but it gives him five EXTRA dice whenever he attacks with his Omni Arm (which allows him to make giant hammers with his arms, swords etc). By far and away his best attack!

In terms of attacking Frostbite doesn't miss much with 14APs of Energy Blast so if he wants to better be able to hit in hand to hand, improving dex and Martial Artist to 4 or 7aps (3 dice or 4 dice extra) is a good bet.

Overall I'd balance Frostbite out. The potential to go heavy hitter is tempting, but getting whacked in the face by the guy who is smarting (but still standing) from your newly mega powered energy blast might be the fastest way to hitch a ride to the morgue...

Steeple_jackuk Fri Nov 23 2018, 17:45

Admin wrote:OOC With regards Lionheart...

Boosting any of your skills means boosting the linked stats too. It will cost 285HP to boost Int to 10 which also includes boosting Detective, Medicine and Directional Hearing, which are linked.

Ok, so I think we'll go with option 2, but not sure then what to do with the other points, given the costs of things. What would you recommend?

I'm happy playing Lionheart, it makes a change to have a character who can go strong and whip the baddies, but often finds himself with limitations that are more to do with not harming the innocent standing by.

The Shadows are returning...wow thought we'd seen the last of them.

I'll reply here to Frostbite as well since it's easier:

Admin wrote: So it's best to go for a balanced approach. Couple of APs on energy blast, maybe 1-2 on Adrenaline surge, 1-2 on Dex/Str/Body or defensive abilities... In terms of attacking Frostbite doesn't miss much with 14APs of Energy Blast so if he wants to better be able to hit in hand to hand, improving dex and Martial Artist to 4 or 7aps (3 dice or 4 dice extra) is a good bet. Skills are good (now that I've changed their use dramatically with the house ruling) because they give you extra dice to roll when they apply to actions, saving you Hero Points.

Ok given what you said about around then I am happy to go for some combination of the above, skills, and or extra on offence/Defence etc. I particularly like the idea of Martial arts and what not, since my go-to attack is always energy, and though that is fine, it would be good to have something with a little more finesse.

So I guess its a question of cost and priority, alround big improvements to Energy blast, Adrenaline surge are going to be the big costs, so maybe with Martial arts, Dex and Skills we might get more bang for our money.

Let me know what you think and then we can be cutting in on the latest big bad. BTW I know just what you mean about wonky eyes, without my peepers I'm hopeless.

Thanks mate

Sj

Admin Mon Nov 26 2018, 20:11

The New Vanguard! Frostbite Issue #7 - Cold and Afraid! - Page 8 Lionheart-current

OOC Boosted Lionhearts intelligence (int) to 10 (from 9) along with the linked skills Detective and Medicine and the power Directional Hearing (which allows him to hear and tell which direction its coming from). Also boosted power reserve from 12 to 13. In game terms this can give him up to 26 Strength, 1 point more than the Byrne era Superman. Truth be told that version was so depowered it was like a different character in the same uniform, so take that with a pinch of salt.he can lift over 1,000,000 tons now when he diverts his power to his strength. Flight boosts to 27AP, a quarter of light speed, Superspeed to 23 (not as fast as classic era flash but plenty quick enough). Telepathy can establish a link mentally (to speak to) within 3500 miles or so. Telekinesis can be used to lift up to 25k tons but this diminishes with range.Basically by increasing 1AP they are sort of twice as effective (in game terms 1AP is no great shakes but it is double the distance/weight/time/volume etc of the previous APs)

Also up by 1 point is Force Field (to 9APs). Had to spend 10HP from his store (he's down to 118HP)

LIONHEART HP 118

Admin Mon Nov 26 2018, 21:51

The New Vanguard! Frostbite Issue #7 - Cold and Afraid! - Page 8 Frostbite-Latest

OOC Not so many improvements, but what there are improve Frostys fighting power. Energy blast up ttwo APs to 16APs, enough to punch (easily) through the side of a battleship. Adrenaline Surge rises to 17APs, meaning he can temporarily boost (up to a max of 17APs) the following, one at a time: Str, Ice Production, Energy Blast, Flight, Ice Control, Dispersal, Weather Control

Martial Artist goes up to 4APs (an extra free die in combat) and Dex (along with Flight) rises to 10APs, making him as agile as Batman in game terms, though acrobatically he's a wooden post compared to the Caped crusader.

Didn't spend the 125HP - you need a few more to improve things like Str (and associated powers) or Body (and Sealed Systems)> That's the problem with linking. Sure it makes things cheaper to buy and to improve BUT you need to improve all of the linked stuff at the same time, and if you have a few of them...

Frostbite HP 125

Steeple_jackuk Mon Nov 26 2018, 22:24

Looks good to me, mate looks like we're tooled up and ready to get back in the game.

Thanks for doing the legwork behind the scenes, sure glad you know your way around the game.

Sj

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